Commonweal has a good article this time, titled All Will Be Well, and subtitled "Julian of Norwich, David Hume, and the problem of evil", by Denys Turner. It also brings in discussion of Duns Scotus, and contemporary Calvinist theologian, Alvin Plantinga. It is a longish article, but worth reading. The problem of evil touches on our discussion in Anne's thread of the meaning of intercessory prayer. It's only fair to point out that it's not going to answer our questions, but shows that people through the ages have kicked around the same dilemmas.
I have posted some excerpts from the article here:
"...Because we are in the thick of it, it can seem obvious that the starting point for the problem of evil cannot be God and God’s omnipotent goodness—Augustine’s starting point. No, the starting point must be with the manifest evil there is in the world, and with the problem of how a good God, who could prevent it, does not do so. This is the approach of the Scottish philosopher David Hume. When it is a matter of where to start in addressing the problem of evil, it seems that the boot is on the skeptical foot."
"...It can seem as if faith in God can never convincingly explain away the world’s evil, let alone justify it, so that it is from those evils that we must start. It was thus that in the late eighteenth century, David Hume formulated the classic statement of what we now call the “problem of evil.”
"...For Hume there just is a problem of evil—anyone who is not a philosopher with an ax to grind can see that...I am not sure this makes Hume an atheist. For certain it makes him a Pyrrhonian skeptic."
"Let us leave Hume there for the moment, because I now want to draw attention to a surprisingly different time, place, and style of reflection on the problem of evil—that of the fourteenth-century English theologian Julian of Norwich. Unlike Hume she believes categorically in the existence of a good and all-powerful God. That said, she shares one thing with him: she is quite baffled at the quandary that is caused by the quantity and viciousness of sin. What’s more, just as Hume refuses to eliminate the problem by way of atheism, so Julian refuses to dissolve the problem by way of theology. She confesses that she does not know why a good and almighty God should have created a world in which there is evil."
"Julian’s book of her “showings,” as she calls them, is an extended set of meditations on a central problem that besets her: she is profoundly troubled by her experience of evil, especially that consciously evil human behavior that she calls generically “sin.” And who would not be after reflecting on conditions in what must be the second nastiest century after our own, ravaged as it was by disease, death, war, poverty, malnutrition, starvation, and economic decline? Julian herself, at the age of eight or nine, had survived the Black Death, which in the space of two years took the lives of one third of the population of England. "
"...You cannot sweep away the evil with some gesture toward the compensating goodness of God. Sin, she says, is real and inexplicable: it may be the source of—or may consist in—all sorts of illusions about ourselves, our fellow human beings, indeed about God."
"...Why, given a God who is omnipotent and all good, is there sin at all? For Julian as for Hume, it is a question that demands that she hold on to the dilemma without eliminating one of its horns. The omnipotent and unfailing love of God and the existence of sin are both undeniable. How, asks Julian, if we cannot deny either, can we assert both and hold the two in tension? "
"...A world of completely free agents who never choose evil actions is certainly describable, but by strict logical necessity even an almighty God could not create one, since for God to cause a human world to be sinless would be for God to rob human choices of their freedom, it being assumed that no action of mine can be free if anything other than I is the cause of it. And that “anything other” includes God. So a world of sinless human beings is describable but uncreatable. In this view, Julian’s question “Why is there sin?” is redundant. Such, for example, is the view of the Calvinist philosopher Alvin Plantinga."
"Christian theologians, especially those who seek the escape route between the horns of Hume’s dilemma that is known as the “free-will defense,” should give serious thought to Julian’s doubt here. One of the reasons Julian is too often presented as a cheerful and empty-headed goody-two-shoes in some pious Christian circles is that readers today fail to see how far she is from pursuing the escape route from the problem of sin available in the conventional “free-will” defense."
"...She is told that in this world with all its sin, with all its “sharp pain,” nothing is “amiss.” In this world, sin is “behovely....As a rough translation into modern English, Julian’s “behovely” means something like “fitting,” or “befitting,” implying that there is something that the behovely fits with and gets its sense from. "
"It has to be admitted that at this point in the argument it is all too easy for the contemporary theologian to lose his or her nerve—and that is why the free-will defense of Plantinga and others can seem to be the only way out for believers. You take Plantinga’s line in order not to be stuck with Julian’s and because you feel weighed down by the heavy burden of human evil. If all you need to say is that evils of such incalculable extent and intensity can’t be helped, that they wouldn’t be sins if they weren’t freely done, and that our not sinning would not be free if God had prevented it, then it’s all our fault and you cannot blame God for sin. In this view, a world without sin would be without humans, occupied only by automata preprogrammed by God. A sinless world is impossible given freedom, and without freedom there are no human beings."
"...Julian’s text refuses completeness in Milton’s sense, in which the occurrence and pervasiveness of sin is said to have been theologically “justified,” for she thought no such justification of God’s ways is possible for us in our time. In not providing one, Julian’s text does not fail of completeness. In what sense, then, is her text not yet “performed”?
"It is the “not yet” that matters here, the provisional. What is provisional is Julian’s theological refusal of both the logical completeness of Plantinga, which would purport to demonstrate the formal consistency of an infinite love’s creating just this sinful world, and the narrative completeness claimed by Milton, which would purport to finish the story that “justifies the wayes of God to men.”
"...For the completed narrative is, literally, the end of the story. And that, Julian knows, is the beatific vision, the price of which is death....In the meantime, there is but the meantime, the “not yet.” And Julian does her theology obedient to the temporality in which neither understanding nor living can yet be “completed"
Katherine, many thanks for this post. I had made it about halfway through the article but then got interrupted by my day and wasn't able to pick it up again.
ReplyDeleteMost of the homilies I've heard on the subject of evil run along the lines of Alvin Plantinga's thought on free will. I lean a bit that way myself; maybe we've got a Calvinist streak imbedded?
DeleteJulian's use of the word "behovely" is intriguing. Not a word I've run across before. Reminds me of "felix culpa", the necessary sin of Adam, in the Exsultet.
Is she saying that it is fitting that there be sin and suffering on earth? I admit I didn't completely understand that passage.
DeleteYeah I don't quite understand that either. I do think that sin and suffering were to a degree inevitable here; that creation will be "perfected" in the next life. There are hints of that in Isaiah, among others.
DeleteI confess I could not make it through the article because I don't understand St. Julian in terms of evil and sin, but in terms of suffering and redemption.
DeleteTwo things about St Julian:
1. She did not claim to have all the answers. She spent her whole life trying to learn and explain lessons from her visions. She was very clear that this was only what God showed *her* and how *she* understood it within the parameters of her faith. I'm fine with calling her a theologian, but I don't think she saw herself that way.
2. She believed that salvation was not possible without sin. It's just logical that you can't save someone if they're not drowning. That doesn't make sin good nor did God encourage us to sin. But the glory of God lies in turning suffering through sin into salvation.
In other words, you sin because you can't help it, and God comes to your rescue as many times as needed because God loves you that much. And God loves you enough to also let you reject rescue and keeps coming back anyway, because God's love and patience are infinite and perfect.
A person (i.e., me) could read St. Julian and be forgiven for wondering whether God's love does not also pursue the sinners in Hell itself. *All* shall be well, she said. Not, Everything but Hell shall be well.
Katherine, what do you think of the Calvinist belief in predestination?
DeleteAnne, I don't get quite THAT far into Calvinism. I guess the only part I really do connect with is the inevitability of sin and suffering. But that is because of free will, and doesn't predestination kind of go against that? And a lot of the situations people get themselves into, they really weren't completely free, which is a mitigating circumstance. I think predestination actually goes the other way, that we were created predestined for heaven, but we can choose not to go there. I realize that I'm not being coherent!
Delete"A person (i.e., me) could read St. Julian and be forgiven for wondering whether God's love does not also pursue the sinners in Hell itself." Jean, I'm heretical enough to lean that direction myself.
DeleteThis article by David Bentley Hart touches on trying to reconcile the presence and persistence of evil with the belief that God is good. He is a fine writer, if a little acerbic. He looks to other sources than those which Denys Turner references. And where he ends up sounds right to me.
ReplyDeletehttps://www.firstthings.com/web-exclusives/2010/01/tsunami-and-theodicy-haiti
https://www.firstthings.com/web-exclusives/2010/01/tsunami-and-theodicy-haiti
That's a good article, Jim. You're right that he is a bit ascerbic. But no one can say that he avoids the hard questions.
DeleteIt seems like he ends up in a similar place to where Denys Turner does in this paragraph; "For the completed narrative is, literally, the end of the story. And that, Julian knows, is the beatific vision, the price of which is death....In the meantime, there is but the meantime, the “not yet.” But Hart gets there by a different road.
I don't see natural disasters as part of the "problem of evil" in the same way that people's deeds are evil.
DeleteWe're physical beings who live in a physical world of shifting techtonic plates, tides, weather extremes, genetic defects, and illnesses. If these disasters say anything about God, I've never heard anything that makes sense.
As Hart says, "I do not believe we Christians are obliged—or even allowed—to look upon the devastation visited upon the coasts of the Indian Ocean and to console ourselves with vacuous cant about the mysterious course taken by God’s goodness in this world, or to assure others that some ultimate meaning or purpose resides in so much misery."
Additional discussion of the subject
ReplyDeletehttps://plato.stanford.edu/entries/evil/