We had that one (America the Beautiful) for an exit hymn this morning. I don't have a problem with patriotic hymns. What I have a problem with is a 20 minute sermon (it wasn't a homily) on July 4th about why we should be more patriotic, and the country is going to hell in a hand basket (well it is, but not for the reasons he gave). My husband says I don't have a good poker face, so it's a good thing we were all facing the same direction.
Did suggest toward the end that some day we may have married priests. No boos; no clapping.. nor our usual parish...this one in firefly land. What a contrast! Not negative, just very different, very very white.
It will be interesting to see where the Synod of Bishops for the Pan-Amazonian Region (to be held in October) goes with the idea of ordaining married men for that region. Since they already do it in the Eastern rites and the Anglican Ordinariate, I wouldn't predict a big problem with it.
Maybe it's just my cynicism, but I laughed out loud when it was announced you could be a married priest ... but only as an indigenous person in the far reaches of Amazonia.
Like saying you can come to the party as long as you stay in the cloak room and don't talk to anyone. I suppose it sets a precedence for allowing married priests in hardship areas ... which may eventually be everywhere.
No patriotic stuff here. Just a call to all of us to be like the 72 sent out to evangelize. There may have been a very oblique slight to the fish fry, an opportunity for evangelization that every year devolves into a competition with the KofC fish fry the next parish over in numbers served and variety of offerings.
Jean: beats bingo bashes all to heck! Out here on the Left Coast, NoCal division, we don't have those things. I miss them from my upper Midwest days of lonnnnnnng ago.
We had those, too, for many years. When the bingo guy died, Father quietly let that enterprise fall away. They have euchre tournaments now and family movie Monday. But bingo raked in the.$$.
The Fall Festival (the last Sunday in October) rakes in the $$ for us. Turkey dinner, lots of games, raffle, auction, not to mention pickle tickets. We call it a "community outreach". Which it is. But also gets us out of the red to the end of the year.
We always have "America the Beautiful" for national holidays. So we had it year last Sunday and the 4th of July. As long as we sing Julia's second verse, I don't have a problem with it. The July 4 homily was by one of the deacons because he is CIA (Conceived in America) while the three Carmelite priests are all FBI (Foreign-Born Indians). Deacon Pete tied "freedom" to the day's readings.
But while we are on the subject, we have the flag of the United States and the papal flag flanking our altar. Does this offend anyone but me and my friend Joe the Baker? The parish's second, and longest-serving, pastor erected three very tall flagpoles outside at the walkway to the Pavilion on which fly the flags of the Vatican, the USA and the state of Florida -- USA in the middle and a bit taller as per the flag code. When he was asked why there was no flag in the sanctuary, he would say, "My goodness, didn't you see our flag when you came in?" Three pastors after him repelled flag fanatics with that answer. Then came the fourth pastor -- the one who sued the bishop for evicting him -- and he put the offending (to me) smaller flags inside. He was FBI (Foreign-Born Irish), too. Does anyone but me feel that the flags -- both of them -- don't belong in the sanctuary?
I guess I agree about the flags, but I'm so used to them being there that I barely notice them. Except a few weeks ago when there was a bat on the papal flag. He caused a lot of distraction. I'm a lot more offended by the attitudes of some church people. I think I would even prefer bats.
I thought it went, "Confirm they soul with border patrol ..." Sorry, that's the Trump campaign song.
I didn't make it to mass on July 4th because I go to our town's parade every year. No patriotic songs in our parish this weekend. When we do patriotism, sometimes we sing "America the Beautiful", more frequently "Let There Be Peace On Earth", which I guess isn't patriotic, strictly speaking, but it's what our last two music directors have chosen.
For that matter, we don't sing "Ave Maria" on the Immaculate Conception - that used to have a patriotic verse about God bless our sweet land or some such, didn't it? Nor do we sing "Hail Holy Queen Enthroned Above" on the Assumption. My kids don't know those hymns; for them at least, the thread of tradition has been snipped.
No flags in our sanctuary. That precedent was set at least five pastors ago, prior to my arrival in the early '90s, and has never been violated. They're out in the narthex.
No "Immaculate Mary" or "Hail Holy Queen", that's sad. Those are two of my old favorites. We use them every Dec. 8 and Aug. 15. We had Schubert's Ave Maria for our wedding, as did my parents. It's musically difficult enough that our choirs don't attempt it. My favorite patriotic hymn is "God of our Fathers", which is another one the choir won't attempt. They occasionally do The Battle Hymn of the Republic.
This is my song, O God of all the nations, a song of peace for lands afar and mine; this is my home, the country where my heart is; here are my hopes, my dreams, my holy shrine: but other hearts in other lands are beating with hopes and dreams as true and high as mine.
My country’s skies are bluer than the ocean, and sunlight beams on cloverleaf and pine; but other lands have sunlight too, and clover, and skies are everywhere as blue as mine: O hear my song, thou God of all the nations, a song of peace for their land and for mine.
Shortly after Vat II, the Jesuit seminary in St. Mary, Kans. (it's owned by the Pius X Society now)decided it needed some atheists to dialogue with and imported four from New York. At one point during the two days of discussion, one of them confessed sheepishly that they often assembled on Sunday mornings for discussions and sang... "The Finlandia song." It's in the hymnal my parish uses, but we've never sung it.
Very singable...first two verses, than third verse runs into imperialism trouble...or at least the one I've seen does.
NB: I have previously gone on about Schubert's German Mass...which we sing in English. The Gloria is hard because I think the music goes with German and not English. However, since we keep doing it, I've noticed we're getting better with the Gloria...of course, the rhythm of our English is sounding a bit...low Dutch.
No flags in my church, thank God. With the unofficial alliance of American bishops with the Republican Party, maybe a statue of Ganesh would be appropriate.
The parish where my mother grew up in Jackson, MI, a beautiful 19th century church on the state's historical register, has a stained glass window with American doughboys and WWI-era sailors kneeling at the feet of the Blessed Virgin. As a snapshot of attitudes during a particular moment in our history, it's hard to top. I've looked a few times for photos online but have never found a good one.
Hit "Publish" too soon ... here is the bottom half or so of the window. Seems I didn't fully describe it ... it's more like our fighting men are bringing the wounded to the Blessed Mother. Hope this link works.
Thanks Jim. That's a lovely church and a beautiful and poignant window. Also a lovely window of St. Cecilia in the video. The song, Jaques Arcadelt's Ave Maria, brings back memories. We sang it in grade school choir. I played it as an organ accompaniment for one of my brothers' weddings (that sounded confusing, he only had one wedding, but I have two brothers).
Yes, very beautiful. I noticed what seem to be nursing sisters, one of whom who is sick. Reference to the flu epidemic that hit at the same time as WWI? I could never figure out, though, why a church in a landlocked town would be named for Mary, Star of the Sea.
Finally, in place of the usual concluding hymn “Adon Olam” (“Sovereign of the Universe”), we sang “This Land is Your Land,” complete with Woody Guthrie’s usually omitted fourth verse:
As I went walking I saw a sign there And on the sign it said “No Trespassing.” But on the other side it didn’t say nothing, That side was made for you and me.
We had that one (America the Beautiful) for an exit hymn this morning. I don't have a problem with patriotic hymns. What I have a problem with is a 20 minute sermon (it wasn't a homily) on July 4th about why we should be more patriotic, and the country is going to hell in a hand basket (well it is, but not for the reasons he gave). My husband says I don't have a good poker face, so it's a good thing we were all facing the same direction.
ReplyDeleteSermon, short and sweet....saying we've run out of nuns and priests....
ReplyDeleteDid suggest toward the end that some day we may have married priests. No boos; no clapping.. nor our usual parish...this one in firefly land. What a contrast! Not negative, just very different, very very white.
DeleteIt will be interesting to see where the Synod of Bishops for the Pan-Amazonian Region (to be held in October) goes with the idea of ordaining married men for that region. Since they already do it in the Eastern rites and the Anglican Ordinariate, I wouldn't predict a big problem with it.
DeleteMaybe it's just my cynicism, but I laughed out loud when it was announced you could be a married priest ... but only as an indigenous person in the far reaches of Amazonia.
DeleteLike saying you can come to the party as long as you stay in the cloak room and don't talk to anyone. I suppose it sets a precedence for allowing married priests in hardship areas ... which may eventually be everywhere.
No patriotic stuff here. Just a call to all of us to be like the 72 sent out to evangelize. There may have been a very oblique slight to the fish fry, an opportunity for evangelization that every year devolves into a competition with the KofC fish fry the next parish over in numbers served and variety of offerings.
ReplyDeleteJean: beats bingo bashes all to heck! Out here on the Left Coast, NoCal division, we don't have those things. I miss them from my upper Midwest days of lonnnnnnng ago.
DeleteWe had those, too, for many years. When the bingo guy died, Father quietly let that enterprise fall away. They have euchre tournaments now and family movie Monday. But bingo raked in the.$$.
DeleteThe Fall Festival (the last Sunday in October) rakes in the $$ for us. Turkey dinner, lots of games, raffle, auction, not to mention pickle tickets. We call it a "community outreach". Which it is. But also gets us out of the red to the end of the year.
DeleteWe don't need any self-control or even a constitution if we have a flag lapel pin.
ReplyDeleteDon't need no stinking constitution! If you don't believe it just ask the president.
DeleteWe always have "America the Beautiful" for national holidays. So we had it year last Sunday and the 4th of July. As long as we sing Julia's second verse, I don't have a problem with it. The July 4 homily was by one of the deacons because he is CIA (Conceived in America) while the three Carmelite priests are all FBI (Foreign-Born Indians). Deacon Pete tied "freedom" to the day's readings.
ReplyDeleteBut while we are on the subject, we have the flag of the United States and the papal flag flanking our altar. Does this offend anyone but me and my friend Joe the Baker? The parish's second, and longest-serving, pastor erected three very tall flagpoles outside at the walkway to the Pavilion on which fly the flags of the Vatican, the USA and the state of Florida -- USA in the middle and a bit taller as per the flag code. When he was asked why there was no flag in the sanctuary, he would say, "My goodness, didn't you see our flag when you came in?" Three pastors after him repelled flag fanatics with that answer. Then came the fourth pastor -- the one who sued the bishop for evicting him -- and he put the offending (to me) smaller flags inside. He was FBI (Foreign-Born Irish), too. Does anyone but me feel that the flags -- both of them -- don't belong in the sanctuary?
I guess I agree about the flags, but I'm so used to them being there that I barely notice them. Except a few weeks ago when there was a bat on the papal flag. He caused a lot of distraction. I'm a lot more offended by the attitudes of some church people. I think I would even prefer bats.
DeleteNo flags in any church I go to now. BUT my childhood church had a U.S., Vatican, And Chicago flag. How'bout that?
DeleteI thought it went, "Confirm they soul with border patrol ..." Sorry, that's the Trump campaign song.
ReplyDeleteI didn't make it to mass on July 4th because I go to our town's parade every year. No patriotic songs in our parish this weekend. When we do patriotism, sometimes we sing "America the Beautiful", more frequently "Let There Be Peace On Earth", which I guess isn't patriotic, strictly speaking, but it's what our last two music directors have chosen.
For that matter, we don't sing "Ave Maria" on the Immaculate Conception - that used to have a patriotic verse about God bless our sweet land or some such, didn't it? Nor do we sing "Hail Holy Queen Enthroned Above" on the Assumption. My kids don't know those hymns; for them at least, the thread of tradition has been snipped.
No flags in our sanctuary. That precedent was set at least five pastors ago, prior to my arrival in the early '90s, and has never been violated. They're out in the narthex.
No "Immaculate Mary" or "Hail Holy Queen", that's sad. Those are two of my old favorites. We use them every Dec. 8 and Aug. 15.
DeleteWe had Schubert's Ave Maria for our wedding, as did my parents. It's musically difficult enough that our choirs don't attempt it.
My favorite patriotic hymn is "God of our Fathers", which is another one the choir won't attempt. They occasionally do The Battle Hymn of the Republic.
This is my land....sung to Finlandia
DeleteThis is my song, O God of all the nations,
a song of peace for lands afar and mine;
this is my home, the country where my heart is;
here are my hopes, my dreams, my holy shrine:
but other hearts in other lands are beating
with hopes and dreams as true and high as mine.
My country’s skies are bluer than the ocean,
and sunlight beams on cloverleaf and pine;
but other lands have sunlight too, and clover,
and skies are everywhere as blue as mine:
O hear my song, thou God of all the nations,
a song of peace for their land and for mine.
Used to sing something to Finlandia in the Unitarian Church, but different words.
DeleteShortly after Vat II, the Jesuit seminary in St. Mary, Kans. (it's owned by the Pius X Society now)decided it needed some atheists to dialogue with and imported four from New York. At one point during the two days of discussion, one of them confessed sheepishly that they often assembled on Sunday mornings for discussions and sang... "The Finlandia song." It's in the hymnal my parish uses, but we've never sung it.
DeleteVery singable...first two verses, than third verse runs into imperialism trouble...or at least the one I've seen does.
DeleteNB: I have previously gone on about Schubert's German Mass...which we sing in English. The Gloria is hard because I think the music goes with German and not English. However, since we keep doing it, I've noticed we're getting better with the Gloria...of course, the rhythm of our English is sounding a bit...low Dutch.
the Finlandia song is in the OCP music edition that our parish uses. I wish we sang it, but we haven't yet.
DeleteWish we would try Schubert's German Mass, too, but it isn't in OCP.
DeleteNo flags in my church, thank God. With the unofficial alliance of American bishops with the Republican Party, maybe a statue of Ganesh would be appropriate.
ReplyDeleteThe parish where my mother grew up in Jackson, MI, a beautiful 19th century church on the state's historical register, has a stained glass window with American doughboys and WWI-era sailors kneeling at the feet of the Blessed Virgin. As a snapshot of attitudes during a particular moment in our history, it's hard to top. I've looked a few times for photos online but have never found a good one.
ReplyDeleteHit "Publish" too soon ... here is the bottom half or so of the window. Seems I didn't fully describe it ... it's more like our fighting men are bringing the wounded to the Blessed Mother. Hope this link works.
Deletehttps://www.google.com/url?sa=i&source=images&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwiJ5-qxzqXjAhXQZs0KHS3LDpkQjRx6BAgBEAU&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3D_ymGFvK2E5A&psig=AOvVaw0NF3lkOiivEUjimHQ4JBth&ust=1562685227521360
Thanks Jim. That's a lovely church and a beautiful and poignant window. Also a lovely window of St. Cecilia in the video.
DeleteThe song, Jaques Arcadelt's Ave Maria, brings back memories. We sang it in grade school choir. I played it as an organ accompaniment for one of my brothers' weddings (that sounded confusing, he only had one wedding, but I have two brothers).
Yes, very beautiful. I noticed what seem to be nursing sisters, one of whom who is sick. Reference to the flu epidemic that hit at the same time as WWI? I could never figure out, though, why a church in a landlocked town would be named for Mary, Star of the Sea.
DeleteMark Silk reports on his Jewish congregation here
ReplyDeleteFinally, in place of the usual concluding hymn “Adon Olam” (“Sovereign of the Universe”), we sang “This Land is Your Land,” complete with Woody Guthrie’s usually omitted fourth verse:
As I went walking I saw a sign there
And on the sign it said “No Trespassing.”
But on the other side it didn’t say nothing,
That side was made for you and me.