The No Kings series of events, or movement, or whatever it is or will become, is getting to be a big deal.
At the top of the post is a photo posted to our town's official Facebook page of the No Kings rally held at a local park on Saturday. I didn't attend, but my wife did - this was her second No Kings rally. According to her, this one was significantly larger than the previous one. Organizers announced that 10,000 people attended the local rally. I saw an Istagram comment that put the number at 16,000. I suppose event organizers tend to round up, and counting heads in a crowd is difficult, but undoubtedly, it was a lot of people. A crowd that size is, if not positively unprecedented, at least rare for our suburb.
I didn't attend; as I had mentioned a few days ago, there was a pro-life march scheduled for a similar time slot, and after some hemming and hawing, I attended it. But on my way to the pro-life march, I drove through the midst of a No Kings protest in the next suburb over. It was big - a magnitude bigger than our pro-life protest a little later that afternoon (the pro-life event seems to shrink a bit every year, although the spirit is still there). Based on what I saw, that suburb's No Kings gathering was large, energetic, boisterous and joyous.
If you're interested in seeing what suburban No Kings protesters look like, there is a photo gallery here of the protest I drove through. The antifa types and similar leftie radicals must be super-clever, because I'm not spotting them at all in these photos. These attendees are typical of suburbanites around here: friendly, a little dorky, surprisingly creative and passionate, but as normal as can be.
According a local news article I saw, there wasn't a single arrest anywhere across the Chicago suburbs at these events - there were dozens of them - yesterday.
I saw a comment in another recent thread, wondering if Catholic clergy were present and visible at the No Kings rallies. I didn't notice any at the one I passed through; and if my wife saw any at the one she attended, she didn't say so. At the pro-life rally, besides my being there (although I don't wear anything that would identify me as a deacon), there was one of my brother deacons (similarly dressed incognito); and there were several priests and a seminarian, all of whom were wearing a cassock and a Roman collar. Most of the priests and the seminarian are from a conservative local religious order founded by a Latin Mass faith community. I'm sort of not surprised that more diocesan clergy don't attend these things. Saturdays are busy for parish priests (confessions, funerals, weddings, and a Saturday evening mass), and one has to commit several hours of one's time to these community marches/events. I have seen in local televised news reports that some priests have been going to the ICE protests in the Chicago area that have been in the national news; although I think they are mostly religious order priests rather than diocesan. I think it's fair to say that most priests, at least the diocesan priests, don't see social justice as a primary aspect of their ministry; or, if they do, they see their role as administrator more than as leaving the parish and marching in the front of the crowd. Maybe, per Francis, they should mingle more with the sheep.
Our local suburban newspaper ran a news article this morning reporting that the No Kings gatherings at some of the large cities across America were very large. The number at Grant Park in Chicago was pegged at 250,000. I think something very big is happening here, and although the events are obviously organized, I think the big attendance and the enthusiasm are mostly organic. As a rough and loose point of comparison, I'm reminded a bit of the Tea Party gatherings from ~15 years ago. Those were mostly organic and sincere, too, at the beginning; and their political opponents promptly denigrated them (just as the Trump administration is now trying to position the No Kings rallies as Hate America rallies). The Tea Party movement eventually translated into political action, too; in the 2010 mid-term, the Republicans picked up 63 seats. Was that to happen next year (in Democrats' favor this time), it would swamp whatever mid-period redistricting Republicans are busily working at. Democrats are trying; my wife tells me that Congressional candidates for both state and federal office made speeches at the No Kings events she's attended.
Over a thousand marchers in the Stroudsburg NKM. I thought it was around two thousand. Great if it can raise consciousness but I felt a tension between my own views and the general spirit. I don’t want to go back to the way things were because that led to the way things are. Also, uncomfortable with the presence of a Democratic politician. I feel they want to hijack the energy for more of the same when we need a real revolution. One Substack article called for no Palestinian Flags to show solidarity. I identify with Workers Strike Back and its noncompliant socialism and uncompromising hostility to Zionism. But I go to the NK marches because I oppose Trump. But I consider them a bridge too less.
ReplyDeleteI would be fine with Democratic politicians speechifying if they were united under a five-point plan of priorities and spoke to them. But as far as I can see, they're just stoking the outrage and ridicule.
DeleteI want to know how they plan to address foreign affairs, global warming, the next pandemic, health care costs, abuses of executive power, pandemic preparation, income inequality, AI and tech, etc etc.
I'm supposing that Democratic politicians and party leaders are surprised (and thrilled, but mostly surprised) at the size and passion of these outpourings to local parks, malls and streets. And they're huffing and puffing to get out in front of it. In this, too, I see a rough parallel with the Tea Party movement.
DeleteIf the Tea Party comparison holds, then what we will see is a new generation of Democrats coming into Congress after the 2026 elections. Remember the Republican Tea Party freshmen shutting down the government? I'm not calling for a government shutdown (let's just get through this one), but noting that a big cadre of motivated freshmen can shake up the Congressional status quo and take the country in a new direction.
From what I can tell, the young, fresh paradigm among Democrats is Mamdani in NYC (with AOC perhaps as a precursor?). Is he a harbinger of the next generation of Democratic leadership? Is a Mamdani type of candidate "exportable" outside of New York and other deep-blue cities? I have my doubts; that photo gallery of local No Kings protesters I linked to in the original post doesn't look to me like a collection of DSA voters. But I'm often wrong.
I’ve been seeing this name a lot recently as a possible rising star. He’s in a tough state though
Deletehttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Talarico
Preponderance of gray-heads in photos of NKMs I've seen in Michigan. No idea what young Democrats find attractive. My kid's a socialist. They had a booth at the Lansing NKM, but he had to work.
DeleteTea Party was fine. Generally informed libertarian types. Some of those at the rallies locally got elected to local boards and did a competent job. I didn't vote for them, but things didn't fall apart, either.
I don't really see the clear line from Tea Party to MAGA that some Democrats are drawing. Difference, ex, between opposing "nanny state" vaccination mandates on principle vs circulating baseless conspiracies about covid shots turning people into state-controlled zombies. Not the same mindset at all as I see it.
I didn't know there was going to be a protest in our town. It wasn't on the "official" list. But there was one. They were on the corner of the main drag going through town. Probably a hundred or so? I'm bad at estimating numbers. Some of them had goofy costumes. Most of the ones I could see were younger people. Full disclosure: if I had known about it, I probably wouldn't have gone. But I drove by slow and gave then a thumbs-up.
ReplyDeleteAnother grass roots demonstration in my home town out west. Which is reliably deep red. My sister said there were likely a hundred people. Standing off the main highway going through town, holding signs, some in costumes. She said there were no arrests that she heard of, and no passers by were shouting or being rude to them.
So is the wind shifting? Maybe.
I don't think the Democrats have a unified message yet, other than MAGA is an unacceptable. Maybe that's enough for now. They'll have to coalesce around some leadership. Not all of which is Democrat. Independent Dan Osborn is running hard against billionaire Pete Ricketts for his Senate seat. Osborn came close to beating out Senator Deb Fisher last time. Fisher and Ricketts are spineless against MAGA, but big money likes them. They don't like Osborn.
I said they didn't have a unified message, which isn't quite true. One thing they are unified about is protection of health care. They want the ACA subsidies, and Medicaid to be protected. Rural hospitals depend on Medicaid a lot. People who don't have employer health plans depend on ACA plans.
DeleteMy opinion about Medicaid as a winning political issue is: it's not a Common Good issue. It's a Preferential Option for the Poor issue. I think Democrats would do better broadening their tent by finding more Common Good issues. Trump has successfully linked immigration to crime, which is a Common Good issue.
DeleteI am on an official list now. But I wasn't. I googled No Kings Day, found the website, found the nearby locations, ranging from DC downtown on the Mall to local suburban gatherings. I chose one of those and signed up on their website.
DeleteJim, according to an AI summary Medicaid is pretty close to being common good. Ironically, this is especially important to the MAGA voters in red states as they have more eligible people there. Also, as Katherine notes, rural hospitals are closing their doors every day as they are pretty dependent on Medicaid payments even now. If milllions of their constituents are cut off (after the 2026 elections of course) sentiment might change.
Delete"As of June 2025, approximately 70.5 million people are enrolled in Medicaid, with another 7.2 million enrolled in the Children's Health Insurance Program (CHIP). In total, Medicaid and CHIP cover about 77.7 million individuals. While children historically made up a slight majority of enrollment, adults now slightly outnumber children in the 49 states and D.C. with complete data, accounting for 52% of the population. "
Medicaid is also a pro-life issue. I am reading that 40% of the births in the US are covered by Medicaid.
DeleteGet rid of Medicaid and see what happens to everybody's insurance premiums because your hospital has to eat the cost of treating poor people.
DeleteEspecially if everyone's insurance premiums already went up because they lost the ACA subsidies. It seems like they're trying to just blow up the system, with no clue about fixing it.
DeleteNot saying Medicaid should be left to die, nor that it's unimportant. But I'm questioning whether it should be the party's signature issue. That 71 million people are enrolled in Medicaid implies that 270 million are not. I believe that works out to less than 20% of Americans being enrolled in Medicaid. I don't think it's going to be a motivating issue for a lot of voters.
DeleteIn Michigan, 27 percent of the population is on Medicaid, most of them kids on MiChild and seniors in nursing homes. Another 16-20 percent of the people here are on Obama care. I looked it up last week when I sent my letters to senators and congressman. That varies by state, but that's a lot of voters.
DeleteIt does seem to be the hill Democrats are willing to die on; whether it will be their "signature issue" in 2026 remains to be seen. We have many long months if Trump shenanigans to come.
If you add up the people who have an ACA plan, and need to keep their subsidy, and also the people who are on Medicare, and need to not have the benefits reduced or the age of access increased; plus the nursing homes and hospitals that need Medicaid to stay open, you have a sum that is larger than any of the parts. Healthcare could very well be one of the signature issues. I'm sure not the only one, but a big part.
DeleteIf not healthcare then what? Freedom? Trump is suppressing freedom of speech, freedom of the press, academic freedom, intellectual freedom, and soon, freedom of religion unless the religion is conservative evangelical Protestantism. Right wing Catholics have been in bed with the evangelicals for years now so they might not notice right away. But it seems that only “liberals”are concerned about the step by step repression of the freedoms Americans take for granted. They won’t win any converts from MAGA land.
DeleteI think the rule of law has to be a signature issue. We have a president and his administration breaking every law and norm they choose to. And a Congress and judiciary system not doing much to stop it. The vice president has famously quoted Andrew Jackson, "The chief justice has made his ruling. Now let him enforce it." They act as though there is no such thing as due process. International law and agreements to which the US are signatories? Pfftt! Who pays any attention to that? They ask for $100, 000 to get a student visa. The president gives billions to bail out Argentina, but lets his lackeys fire civil servants on a whim. The corruption and lawlessness has to be an issue. In the end itvwill affect everyone.
DeleteKatherine, I agree wholeheartedly!
DeleteKatherine you are absolutely correct. But many MAGAs are fine with trump trampling on laws and the constitution because they are getting what they want - permission to be openly prejudiced - the end of political correctness, and what they call woke. They like trumps superficial “ toughness”, his penchant for schoolboy bathroom humor , his open use of vulgarity . Too many think like my brother in law, an evangelical Libertarian who says trump is the best President in American history. I have a FB friend who has a couple of MAGA friends who share a lot of MAGA memes on her timeline ( she’s not MAGA) and comments. I think she doesn’t know how to set her privacy settings to prevent them from showing up. If they are typical of MAGA think then nothing will budge them. No logic at all, only parroting what they read and hear in their right wing bubbles. Both are evangelical , one lives in Arizona, and is either more careless than average with typing or he is pretty illiterate. They may not even know about the money being seen to satisfy trumps whims like bailing out fellow autocrats. I checked Fox News when the stories of trumps perverted AI video came out and it was all over the news sites in the country- except for Fox. Even trumps favorite newspaper (The New York Post) had it. BTW, does his former favorite still exist - The National Inquirer? He and the WSJ seem to have parted ways lately too
DeleteSo it’s really up to the Dems to field a few non- extreme candidates, and a few well defined policies, and capture more of the independents vote. According to a report I read today trump’s approval for handling the economy continues to drop, and is in 30s approval. But it’s still a year away from the mid- terms too soon to tell. The judiciary keeps caving to his unlawful orders.
Jim, I'm not going to be too hard on the Catholic clergy who didn't show up. As you pointed out, Saturday is a working day for them, especially the priests. The ones here are staying apolitical. I'll take that as a win. And we don't know if some of them might have been wearing civvies. I was just praying hard there wouldn't be violence. And there doesn't appear to have been any serious instances.
ReplyDeleteOf course Trump's response on Truth Social was disappointing, as expected. Grade school level poop joke video, I'm sure probably AI generated.
Listened to Bill Kristol on The Bulwark report his thoughts about the NK he attended. No speeches or program in his suburb (McLean, Va.), just people gathering to talk and express mutual concern over Trump's policies and abuses of constitutional rights. Many people work/worked in government, many Republicans in the crowd.
ReplyDeleteStanley, any good chats with others at your rally? Give you any renewed faith in fellow Americans?
Jim, you reported on the rally that you didn't attend, and I'd be interested in the one you did. Where is are pro-lifers now that Roe is gone? Has attention turned to state laws? Banning of abortion pills? Shut down of clinics? Mostly women at the rally? Are parishes still sending confirmation candidates to these things?
My husband always goes to the march for life that they have here the first Sunday in October. I haven't been to one in twenty years. I say the rosary for them at home, but I'm not always sure what I'm praying for. I guess the seamless garment? I feel that one issue politics has helped to warp the political landscape. Kelly said it was pretty quiet for the most part, but he saw a couple of women in goofy looking outfits on the other side of the street, wearing red capes and white bonnets. I told him it was from the Handmaiden's Tale. Which was a depressing dystopian novel.
DeleteSo what IS the message at pro-life rallies now?
DeleteMichigan pro-lifers got mired in anti-trans arguments when the state abortion rights amendment was on the ballot following Roe. Probably par for the course given their social conservatism, but muddled the issues quite badly.
IMO, their best argument was that the amendment would negate the restrictions on abortion passed under Roe that reflected widely held values in the state. But that wasn't amplified enough.
So I wonder if Trump and the administration will catch any flack for their initiative to make IVF available to everyone? Seems like it should, since selective destruction of embryos is implicit.
Deletehttps://www.usccb.org/resources/Pain_Capable_2023_0.pdf
DeleteIt’s time for compromise. This letter implies that the bishops might compromise. If the “pro- life” movement wants to really be pro-life it will change tactics from banning abortion from the moment of conception to a reasonable limit - the one polls show is supported by the vast majority of Americans- , and adopt the seamless garment approach that both Francis and Leo seem to advocate. Abortion is legal in most European countries up to 15 or 16 weeks. The RCC there doesn’t waste millions on funds trying to suppress it even in majority (nominally) Catholic countries.
The transgender population in the US is between 0.8 and 1.0%. As far as I know, they do not pose any kind of real threat to the 99%. So the fuss must be meant to keep the evangelical- white Catholic MAGAs riled up about a cultural issue that really doesn’t touch them unless they have a daughter who is hoping to be an Olympic athlete. I do think that it may not be totally just for born female athletes to have to compete with born male athletes who have a different muscular system that sometimes gives them an advantage in some sports.
DeleteMichigan had what I considered reasonable restrictions under Roe (informed consent, parental consent, late term restrictions, etc). Unfortunately, when it came to a vote it was between reversion to the pre-Roe 1931 laws that did not protect women with ectopic pregnancies, and anything-goes constitutional amendment, and the amendment won by a huge margin.
DeleteNow pro-lifers are in a weakened position if they want to claw back Roe-era restrictions. But I'm not even sure that's their aim.
Hence my question about what all is going on at the pro-life rallies.
IVF is a racket, and there are a lot of legal gray areas concerning embryos, who has jurisdiction over them, and what can be done with them. It's been awhile since I read up on this, but I think this varies from state-to-state.
Rather than trying to ban IVF, which seems like the pro-lifer fallback position on all these reproductive issues, they might want to look at restrictions on and oversight of IVF clinics.
I think I have posted the results of the nationwide study on trans people in the U.S. before. Anne is right about the percentage of trans people in the general population.
DeleteTrump wants to suppress these types of studies (just as he wanted to suppress COVID numbers). That, of course, makes it easier for the culture warriors to make up info and overstate the dangers of things they find "perverted."
It seems to me that all sides of an argument benefit from having correct info. But MAGA and the white Christian nationalists love their alternative reality.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2025/aug/20/trans-people-us-data
"Jim, you reported on the rally that you didn't attend, and I'd be interested in the one you did. Where is are pro-lifers now that Roe is gone? Has attention turned to state laws? Banning of abortion pills? Shut down of clinics? Mostly women at the rally? Are parishes still sending confirmation candidates to these things?"
DeleteYeah, great questions. It's hard for me to point to a difference between what this group was doing pre-Dobbs and post-Dobbs. They're still doing the same things. They do this march every year. The signs this year said, "Choose love / choose life". Every year they say the same thing, or something similar. They still do a 40 Days for Life thing every year. They still go to an abortion clinic and be present / witness, and try to get some "Saves" if possible.
None of that is bad. Maybe they're all examples of what the church should be doing: witnessing to the gift of life.
They're not really too focused on political action per se. Once in a while I'll get an email along the lines of, "Call your state rep to vote NO to HB xxxx," which I am sure originate from more overtly political advocacy groups.
My closest friend here, a genuinely devout Greek Orthodox with very strong faith, has four grandchildren conceived by IVF. One of my nephews and his wife have three children conceived by IVF. My rabidly anti- abortion and equally rabid MAGA sister doesn’t know this - she thought the twins ( a boy and a girl) were a family inheritance because our grandmother was a twin with a brother. Apparently my sister doesn’t understand the differences between fraternal and identical twins. She still doesn’t know they were IVF babies. My nephew and his wife are MAGA fanatics and moved to Utah from California to get away from the libs. They have cut off my son and his wife from their social media feeds because they are both outspoken about trump on their own social media posts. They especially point out that most trump folk who claim to be Christian actually don’t seem acquainted with Jesus’s teachings in the gospels.
DeleteThis administration wants more babies - preferably white babies. More white people complete college than minorities and this imbalance may worsen with the trump war on minorities. The more educated population defers marriage to late 20s or early 30s and kids even later. They may run into difficulties getting pregnant and use IVF. But it’s very expensive. So it’s likely he will carry out his promise to help with IVF costs and not worry about the unused embryos. Our next door neighbor just retired. He is a reproductive endocrinologist, meaning his practice was all IVF and also eventually traveling overseas to recruit surrogate women to carry pregnancies for his clients who failed to conceive with IVF. His country for his group practice was Ireland. The doctors in the practice had their “ own” target countries.
We have never discussed his medical specialty. I have no moral trouble with IVF but I do have qualms about paying women overseas to carry a pregnancy.
Not sure this was the report I read, but Atlantic story highlights lack of oversight in the fertility biz broadly speaking. Might have to sign up for the free trial to get thru pay wall:
Deletehttps://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2024/05/america-ivf-regulation-failures/678259/
I agreed with Pope Francis when he said surrogacy is exploitive. There may be exceptions of women who do it as compassion for a family member, but otherwise it's women who need the money, and it's a business transaction.
DeleteKatherine, assume that you explained the novel to Kelly. He will see women dressed like that frequently in many forms, including print. The Handmaid’s Tale was also made into a movie and a TV series.
DeleteYeah, I read the book years ago. Didn't want to watch the movie or the series, too depressing.
DeleteFrom the Atlantic article - “ The U.S. fertility industry is unique in its lack of rules and oversight, compared with other countries and other fields of medicine.”
DeleteJust one more way our profit motivated healthcare system is inferior to those of most developed countries. Their systems aren’t based on profit, but on delivering the best healthcare possible.
Katherine I didn’t even want to read the book much less watch a movie or TV series. It was too depressing just reading articles about it. But anyone pushing anti- abortion should be aware of what the red capes and white bonnets symbolize
Delete"The signs this year said, "Choose love / choose life." ... They still do a 40 Days for Life thing every year. They still go to an abortion clinic and be present / witness, and try to get some "Saves" if possible. None of that is bad. Maybe they're all examples of what the church should be doing: witnessing to the gift of life."
DeleteNo, none of that is bad. I have my own little prayer observances on All Souls. But I think it's increasingly hard to "sell" all fetal life as a gift.
Would any protesters at an abortion clinic know how to help if any "saves" said "no, I don't really want to abort, but I've got no health care and my boyfriend is a dick"?
I would have nothing to offer that woman, and I guess that's why I'm more inclined to send my piddly assistance to the baby pantry.
"Would any protesters at an abortion clinic know how to help if any "saves" said "no, I don't really want to abort, but I've got no health care and my boyfriend is a dick"? I would have nothing to offer that woman, and I guess that's why I'm more inclined to send my piddly assistance to the baby pantry.''
DeleteRight. There are avenues of assistance - or at least possible avenues of assistance; the social safety net is not exactly comprehensive and holistic - and I believe the "street counseling" training sessions do cover these topics. But whether that info is conveyed accurately, or at all, in the moment is something I'm not able to answer.
Jean, I had some interaction. I actually drove my neighbor and her friend, who left HER car at the endpoint so we could ride back to the beginning. Some people are moving toward socialism at least to the point of banning billionaires. My sign mentioned Gaza but there was not much in the way of genocide mention generally. Democrats often consider it in bad taste something like prolife aborted fetus pictures. There are some black people at the marches but not a lot. I guess they figure that once the white people solve THEIR problems, they’ll be unbothered with black people still having theirs. Some articles by Democratic pundits wanted Palestine activists to shut up so they could have unity. Personally, I don’t know how any of the No Kings problems can be solved without stopping aid for the genocide. My sign listed the genocide among the other complaints but I think I made a mistake.
ReplyDeleteThe Socialists in Lansing had a booth set up, but The Boy said they didn't get much interest. He was working, but his friends said people think Democrats will have a better chance of getting in and blocking Trump. Anything that would split the Democratic vote is seen as a threat to ousting MAGAs from Congress.
DeleteThe main speaker was a community leader in the Hispanic community. Lots of union leaders, teachers, and librarians. So the thrust was really about constitutional rights and freedoms.
But I can't see where highlighting Gaza is ever a mistake. It's all tied up with too much executive power to fuel weapons sales and death.
Completely off topic, but anyone heard of "souling"? An old All Souls custom in which every cake given to the poor releases a soul from Purgatory. Gonna start seeing my annual candy giveaway for trick-or-treat that way. Every candy bar is a prayer for souls crossing over. Except, of course, for the candy bars I raid ahead of time.
ReplyDeleteMore here: https://www.medieval.eu/soul-cakes-and-souling
I have a bread cookbook (A World of Breads, by Dolores Casella), which has a recipe for Soul Cakes. Actually it is just an adaptation of a rich roll dough, to which you add cinnamon, and form into buns.
DeleteInteresting. I had never heard of this until somebody in my Old English literature group posted the story about it. Nicer custom than the Welsh Sin Eater, who ate biscuits or bread from a corpse, thus taking on their sins so the dead person could go to heaven.
Delete"The sin eater", that was a disturbing Twilight Zone episode!
DeleteOh, yah, I remember that. I think that was a Night Gallery epidsode where that guy who played John-Boy Walton had to eat the sins of his sin eater father. I guess that's how the tradition went in Appalachia.
DeleteThe last season of Fargo featured a sin eater.
I think that Catholics can perform acts of prayer at certain times/places to confer indulgences on a soul or souls in Purgatory. Not like eating their sins, but similar idea of expunging sin after death to release the soul from torment.
Except that the soul is probably not actually being tormented. But eating sweet rolls sounds like a great way to get “indulgences” for souls in “ purgatory”.
DeleteI think the original soul cakes were just round quick breads, nutritious but not fancy or sweet. Oat cakes, cheese, peas, and fish (especially eels) were pretty much the core of Anglo-Saxon diets in the early Middle Ages. Women would make a batch of these for the family every day or two.
DeleteI like the idea that a kindness on Earth reverbs in Purgatory. Seems like it would encourage charity among believers who couldn't otherwise afford masses or prayers for their dead loved ones. Sorta like those NPR fund drives where some big sponsor agrees to match your donation for a limited time.
“ couldn’t afford masses …for their loved ones”.,, the whole idea of paying for masses and prayers for the loved ones who are deceased is repellant. God expects this? I sure hope not. Sounds more like one of trumps endless money making schemes than anything Jesus taught. Jesus didn’t teach that God’s mercy has to be bought. Indulgences are back too and are really a bad belief for the church to push, even if they no longer “sell” them.,
DeleteSorry, not pushing indulgences. They'd become a racket by the time Chaucer wrote about the Pardoner.
DeleteSoul cakes were a topic in my Old English lit group, and I wondered if it was a custom that survived in some form that you cradle Catholics might remember.
This is from the opening prayers of a vigil service for the deceased, from Kelly's book of Order of Christian Funerals (he does a lot of vigil or wake services). Anyway, "...brothers and sisters, we believe that all the ties of friendship and affection which knit us as one throughout our lives do not unravel with death." To me that is what prayers for the dead are about. It's not "bailing them out of purgatory". It's praying for their well-being if they haven't crossed the threshold of heaven yet, and remembering them.
DeleteWe didn't have the custom of soul cakes in our family (though my grandma could usually be talked into baking treats). I sometimes used to go with her to the cemetery on All Souls Day to visit the graves and pray for the dead relatives. There was one grave I remember, a cousin of grandma's, who died in 1885. He was only 21. The epitaph on his gravestone was " Blessed are the pure of heart, for they shall see God." You don't see epitaphs much any more because it costs too much to carve the letters. But they are interesting to read in the old parts of cemeteries.
Jean, your Old English lit group sounds interesting.
"... the ties of friendship and affection which knit us as one throughout our lives do not unravel with death." That is lovely and true whether you believe in the Hereafter or not.
DeleteThis morning my OE group was translating maxims from the Exeter book. One guy likes to render his in runes. I turned mine into a haiku! It's fun. If you're me.
Beam sceal on eorðan leafum liþan, leomu gnornian.
Ev'ry tree on earth
Must lose its leaves in autumn,
And so its limbs grieve.
I don’t know anything about people hanging out in some spiritual place before crossing a threshold, so I don’t pray to, or for, the dead. It’s tough enough to participate in intercessory prayer for the living. I do it because it can’t hurt, but I don’t think it actually helps either.
DeleteLove the idea of soul cakes though. The deceased can’t enjoy them, but I can.
Jean, I like your haiku so much I’m saving it to my save nice thought folder.
The other thought is that the leaves usually return. Our trees are now mostly bare, but not yet full winter bare. We can again see the houses of our neighbors on the other side of the woods, and their lights that always comfort me once the dark days hit.,
We always get more moonlight in the living room when the neighbor's maple loses its leaves.
DeleteThe group seems to be on a tree theme. Yesterday it was birches from the Runic Poem. I didn't get in on that one:
The birch bears no fruit; yet without seed it brings forth shoot. Splendid are its branches and gloriously adorned its lofty crown, covered with leaves, reaches to the skies.
Beorc byþ bleda leas, bereþ efne swa ðeah
tanas butan tudder, biþ on telgum wlitig,
heah on helme hrysted fægere,
geloden leafum, lyfte getenge
The line about the birch bearing no fruit started a train of thought that ended with me wondering if maple tree "helicopters" are edible. I asked the Google machine, and it turns out they are. Best eaten while the pods are green. After peeling away the outer papery husks, the seeds can be boiled or roasted - the latter allegedly gives it a bit of a nutty flavor. The seeds can also be ground into a flour which can be used to thicken soups or stews.
DeleteMy cat eats them all the time and then horks them up in front if the davenport.
DeleteJim that's interesting about the helicopters. Sounds like they'd be sort of like edamame. Believe I'll buy that at the store, though.
DeleteI was curious about hackberries too. I follow a "native foods in Nebraska" FB page. It turns out that hackberries are edible, too. They are said to taste kind of like dates. I'm not picking them off the ground though. My tree climbing days are long since over, hackberry trees are quite tall.